Cliches & Tropes of Ranma fanon

[Drawde]

Genma is the leader, and the leader is always reresponsible for what the people they lead do.

Only to an extent. Not only are people individuals, but there is literally no way to control someone at all times. In fact, trying to do so usually results in that person acting out every chance they get. People aren't robots who do exactly as you program them to, and most laws accept this, and thus don't punish people for things they had no control over. Only the most totalitarian governments have tried this, in an effort to scare people into making sure people they're in charge of act properly as well as themselves. Micromanagement at it's worst.

Note that parents do suffer from this, though still not completely. After all, parents are supposed to be the ones that taught their children how to act. But children are still individuals, and thus see things differently than other people.

[Tovath]

Even if you assume for little to no reason Shampoo is law enforcement that still does not excuse her attacking random people at the Tendo Dojo when she lost her temper.

As it stands what little we see of the area Shampoo lives in makes it seem lawless beyond what the local villages enforce on those who live in them. A very might makes right type place.

Zwzn what are you trying to argue? What Shampoo does has no baring on what Ranma did before they met.

Ignorance and hunger are no excuse for breaking the law.

I already said you can stack mitgating circumstances as much as ya want, thats not the point.

If you see food in some strange village do you immediatly pig out? Or ask your guide, hey can we eat that food? Ranma and Genma didnt care, they took what they wanted.

Yes Ranma took responsibility that what he did was wrong. So now would you please admit what Ranma did was wrong.

There is nothing wrong with making a stupid mistake because of lack of food or water. You just don't think straight when hungery or thirsty.

You also seem to be forgeting that it is shown that many people Ranma ran into in China where very generous with food. The way Ranma was acting it seems almost like the villages he went to before hand put out tables of food for people to eat.

He still broke the law. You can argue motivation all day if you want, but the fact remains that he did eat the food and that broke the law.

Oh and Im not buying its all Genma's fault. Legally Ranma is just as responsible.

Genma is the leader, and the leader is always reresponsible for what the people they lead do.
.

No, A person is always responsible for their own actions, both morally and under International law.

[Zwzn]

Genma is the leader, and the leader is always reresponsible for what the people they lead do.

Only to an extent. Not only are people individuals, but there is literally no way to control someone at all times. In fact, trying to do so usually results in that person acting out every chance they get. People aren't robots who do exactly as you program them to, and most laws accept this, and thus don't punish people for things they had no control over. Only the most totalitarian governments have tried this, in an effort to scare people into making sure people they're in charge of act properly as well as themselves. Micromanagement at it's worst.

Note that parents do suffer from this, though still not completely. After all, parents are supposed to be the ones that taught their children how to act. But children are still individuals, and thus see things differently than other people.

That didn't come out right.

It's not that I don't think Ranma is not at fault, but that Genma caused the problems that got Ranma in trouble. Genma raised Ranma since before Ranma seemingly could walk or talk. Any skills Ranma lacks is Genma fault for either not teaching Ranma, or being unable to teach Ranma, and not finding someone who could teach Ranma.

Ranma's behavor is rather odd as well. Shampoo tried to kill him, and he takes it as a hello like that sort of thing happens all the time. This is Genma's training at work. Genma taught Ranma to fight, but skipped social skills.

Now it also seems Genma failed to pack the needed supplies for the trip. That ment they had to go hungery.

So, Ranma failed in working things out after eating a small part of Shampoo's prize because Ranma never got the training he needed.

On some level everything happened because of Genma doing, or failing to do something in the past.

Ranma got the kiss of death because Genma failed to do certain things.

This doesn't seem to be what I mean exactly either, but it's a lot closer.

[Zwzn]

Even if you assume for little to no reason Shampoo is law enforcement that still does not excuse her attacking random people at the Tendo Dojo when she lost her temper.

As it stands what little we see of the area Shampoo lives in makes it seem lawless beyond what the local villages enforce on those who live in them. A very might makes right type place.

Zwzn what are you trying to argue? What Shampoo does has no baring on what Ranma did before they met.

Shampoo's behavor did not change just because she won the prize. She has always been a thug who does what she wants because no one stops her, or those who might want to can't.

The area Shampoo's village is in seems to have little in the way of the rule of law.

Ignorance and hunger are no excuse for breaking the law.

I already said you can stack mitgating circumstances as much as ya want, thats not the point.

If you see food in some strange village do you immediatly pig out? Or ask your guide, hey can we eat that food? Ranma and Genma didnt care, they took what they wanted.

Yes Ranma took responsibility that what he did was wrong. So now would you please admit what Ranma did was wrong.

There is nothing wrong with making a stupid mistake because of lack of food or water. You just don't think straight when hungery or thirsty.

You also seem to be forgeting that it is shown that many people Ranma ran into in China where very generous with food. The way Ranma was acting it seems almost like the villages he went to before hand put out tables of food for people to eat.

He still broke the law. You can argue motivation all day if you want, but the fact remains that he did eat the food and that broke the law.

It is agaist the law to make mistakes? What ever the reason Ranma thought the food was for everyone to just eat. When he realized things where not as he thought he stopped eating. Then he tried to work things out with the owner even if he did a poor job of it. No laws broken. Just honest mistakes on Ranma's part at least.

Oh and Im not buying its all Genma's fault. Legally Ranma is just as responsible.

Genma is the leader, and the leader is always reresponsible for what the people they lead do.
.

No, A person is always responsible for their own actions, both morally and under International law.

Genma ate the prize as well. Genma ate more of the prize then Ranma. Ranma was held responsible for Genma's actions. Genma at no time took responsibility for his actions. Genma left Ranma to deal with something Genma seems to almost made sure Ranma could not effectively do.

I would like to know what laws Ranma broke. Ranma made no atempt to steal anything.

[three headed dog]

Ranma broke the law out of ignorance of the culture/area laws, this is a very easy mistake to make hundreds of people do it (just look at when people from the USA go to a Muslim country), particularly easy in this case since the Amazons appear to be an autonomous people with their own laws and culture different from the rest of China (which means Ranma could have been assuming one set of laws and culture and got another entirely).

It is also true that Ranma takes an inordinate amount of the blame, Genma is at the very least as guilty as Ranma, arguably more so since Ranma is legally a minor (in many cultures the fault/punishment would be only on Genma since Ranma is a minor and can not, in many places, be held legally accountable -different countries different laws and values). Before people blame Shampoo's people laws too much think about some other real world laws and punishments like the fact that only three countries in the world still allow the death penalty for juveniles: USA, Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC), and Iran. Countries like Pakistan, North Korea and China have abolished it (source amnesty international).

I feel that you (Zwzn) are underestimating Ranma's social abilities a great deal. Ranma has shown that he can, when he wants to, follow the social order (he uses honorific when talking to Soun or Kasumi for example). The fact that he can manipulate people, like the french guy, points to Ranma having greater social skills than you seem to imply. The thing is in this case Ranma did what many people would do upon hearing that it was a prize. Namely take the easiest means, if entry into the competition is allowed and he legitimately wins than there would be no problem. Had Shampoo not accepted a challenge than I am positive Ranma would have tried other means to make amends (he has used other tactics in the manga and has made amends for his actions at other times) like offering to pay for it or do some type of work in the village.

The fact is it is just a bad situation, similar type things happen all the time. No one is really that much at fault or could argue that everyone is partially at fault, Shampoo is just following her people's laws, Ranma and Genma just made a mistake, the guide didn't bother to tell them anything about the village prior to taking them there (yes I give some blame to him for not telling them about important things, things that could get you killed should have been told), etc...

[Necavit]

Ah well I tried, I was just curious if I could make you admit Ranma did wrong.

Seeing as everyone else here and Ranma himself admit it was wrong to simply eat without asking.

No legal system would agree with this Genma is the leader. You try pulling that when your 16.

You make it sound like Ranma was wasting away, for a guy on the brink of death he sure whooped Shampoo with ease. He was thinking fine, he often takes without asking.

Ah well but as always you and I are just going back and forth, and it seems you have enough people to argue with here. So Im done.

[Drawde]

Shampoo's prize. The dragon-whisker soup. The meal that that guy from Heron Island was about to eat (the Cinderella story). Three out of four of Ranma's flashbacks to China that we see (the other being Jusenkyo) involve Ranma stealing food.

Not to mention that Shampoo and Ukyo both work at restaurants, and that Akane can't cook. You'd think Ranma would have learned by now that food is bad for him

[Zwzn]

Ranma broke the law out of ignorance of the culture/area laws, this is a very easy mistake to make hundreds of people do it (just look at when people from the USA go to a Muslim country), particularly easy in this case since the Amazons appear to be an autonomous people with their own laws and culture different from the rest of China (which means Ranma could have been assuming one set of laws and culture and got another entirely).

As far as we the reads can tell only Genma stole anything. Ranma just made a mistake, and tried to work things out in a way he had thought would have no lasting. There is a big difference between what Ranma did, and stealing.

The outsider laws are things Shampoo has to follow, and not Ranma

Genma and Ranma had a guide with them.

It is also true that Ranma takes an inordinate amount of the blame, Genma is at the very least as guilty as Ranma, arguably more so since Ranma is legally a minor (in many cultures the fault/punishment would be only on Genma since Ranma is a minor and can not, in many places, be held legally accountable -different countries different laws and values). Before people blame Shampoo's people laws too much think about some other real world laws and punishments like the fact that only three countries in the world still allow the death penalty for juveniles: USA, Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC), and Iran. Countries like Pakistan, North Korea and China have abolished it (source amnesty international).

Genma kept eating after he found out from the guide the food was not ment for just anyone to eat, but Ranma stopped eating.

I feel that you (Zwzn) are underestimating Ranma's social abilities a great deal. Ranma has shown that he can, when he wants to, follow the social order (he uses honorific when talking to Soun or Kasumi for example). The fact that he can manipulate people, like the french guy, points to Ranma having greater social skills than you seem to imply. The thing is in this case Ranma did what many people would do upon hearing that it was a prize. Namely take the easiest means, if entry into the competition is allowed and he legitimately wins than there would be no problem. Had Shampoo not accepted a challenge than I am positive Ranma would have tried other means to make amends (he has used other tactics in the manga and has made amends for his actions at other times) like offering to pay for it or do some type of work in the village.

I was talking about how poorly Ranma handled things with Shampoo in her village. Ranma's body language alone likely angered Shampoo. Edit: Ranma should have behaved in a more humble manner like he did when he first met the Tendos.

The fact is it is just a bad situation, similar type things happen all the time. No one is really that much at fault or could argue that everyone is partially at fault, Shampoo is just following her people's laws, Ranma and Genma just made a mistake, the guide didn't bother to tell them anything about the village prior to taking them there (yes I give some blame to him for not telling them about important things, things that could get you killed should have been told), etc...

It almost seems like the guide is Edit: purposely with holding information until it is too late, but this is the Ranmaverse, and people are that stupid.

Ah well I tried, I was just curious if I could make you admit Ranma did wrong.

Seeing as everyone else here and Ranma himself admit it was wrong to simply eat without asking.

No legal system would agree with this Genma is the leader. You try pulling that when your 16.

You make it sound like Ranma was wasting away, for a guy on the brink of death he sure whooped Shampoo with ease. He was thinking fine, he often takes without asking.

Ah well but as always you and I are just going back and forth, and it seems you have enough people to argue with here. So Im done.

I can't stand it when someone is accused of doing something they did not do. That is why I am arguing this point. It does not matter if Ranma lied, cheated, or stole before or after Shampoo's prize(Ranma did).

Words mean alot to me. That is why I am arguing Ranma did not steal Shampoo's prize. Stealing something means you try to away without a form of payment, or punishment.

[Necavit]

Really? Cause Ive worked in retial.

When we catch em, the first thing they usually do is try to work something out. Offering to pay ect.

Lets say Ranma ate, walked away, and than the guide said "Hey thats stealing, it wasnt for you" But Ranma was away from the village.

Would he go back and offer to pay, like hes never done. Or would he just keep on going, as we see in ample evidence.

[Necavit]

Double post

[Zwzn]

Really? Cause Ive worked in retial.

When we catch em, the first thing they usually do is try to work something out. Offering to pay ect.

I've worked in retial.

That is different from what happened with Shampoo's prize. Ranma realized what he was doing was "wrong", and then got "caught".

Lets say Ranma ate, walked away, and than the guide said "Hey thats stealing, it wasnt for you" But Ranma was away from the village.

Would he go back and offer to pay, like hes never done. Or would he just keep on going, as we see in ample evidence.

That sounds similar to what Ranma did whne he met the guy who he steped on a second time.

[Spokavriel]

Didn't Ranma also try to make up for the bread feud by buying all the breads he could remember having caught over Ryouga and handing them to him? It's not a smart way to go about it but he did try to make equal restitution.

[nodregah]

One little thing that is being overlooked. Shampoo traveled to a foreign country to kill one of its citizens. While she may or may not be law enforcement for her village is a moot point. There are laws set up for extradition and yes, even Japan follows them. Also, countries do not like extraditing their citizens for execution. She is in Japan to commit an illegal act and therefore is clearly in the wrong. To get the so called justice that she, and her laws advocate, shed would have to wait until Ranma has left the protection of Japanese boarders. Even then, a Japanese citizen killed by a Chinese citizen over food and arcane laws would cause one hell of a diplomatic uproar. China's Communist government, to kill bad press, would act. Remember, martial arts are great, just not against planes and bombs. Also, China is a nuclear state and can "test" any weapon they want in their own boarders.

These are just some thoughts that came to me while looking at this thread. I am NOT saying Ranma is blameless. I am just saying Shampoo is more guilty than Ranma. Ranma could be charged with petit theft then plead self defense on an assault charge. Shampoo would be charged with Aggravated assault and attempted murder.

just the ramblings of a tired mind.

[Spokavriel]

One might argue that Shampoo went beyond the rule of law. After all the oath is to chase to the ends of Earth and kill. If you get technical the coast is an end of earth/land. Track to the ends not beyond them.

[Necavit]

All evidence points that Ranma has no trouble stealing if he isnt confronted about it.

He only offers to repay if confronted, such with the guy he stepped on or with Shampoo.