Do you like the use of Japanese words in fanfiction

Post any fanfiction related polls here

Do you like the use of Japanese words in fanfiction

like them they remind that the story takes place in japan
17
12%
like them they remind that the story takes place in japan
17
12%
only for difficult to translate into english like honorifics
39
28%
only for difficult to translate into english like honorifics
39
28%
Don't care one way or the other
9
7%
Don't care one way or the other
9
7%
annoying and distract from story
3
2%
annoying and distract from story
3
2%
hate them all the words should be in english
1
1%
hate them all the words should be in english
1
1%
 
Total votes : 138

Postby Rei-chan » Mon May 01, 2006 7:05 am

Ehh... must admit I don't really care about it one way or the other. There are certain expressions most of fanfiction readers know such as the gomen and hai as well as honorifics that there is no point in even noticing them occur. I read through them just like I would english, barely even notice the language shift. As for stories that write half of it in japanese.. meh, I will look it up if I have to, that actually is kind of fun when that one happens.
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Postby Himitsu » Mon May 01, 2006 10:41 am

Stuff like honorifics, attack names, certain hard to translate japanese words are ok. When a fic is in english you shouldn't have whole conversations where it's all japanese. Sure, it may make you feel like, "Hey, I know how people introduce themselves in japanese, yay me", but generally it just annoys your readers.
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Postby crystlshake » Wed May 03, 2006 5:13 am

Cultural overdose is just as bad. I remember reading a story where they insisited calling the majority of the house and its parts by it's Japanese equivalent. This is all fine and good in small doses if you use part of the paragraph to thrue description let the reader infer the definition. Now if you have a bunch of this with a moderate conversation using the Japanese words youve just gone into major overkill. If your using unknown words your audience is not going to be able to adjust and retain their meaning if they have most of anouther paragraph to translate along with it. Its at that point where you have to step back and ask which language you plan your readers to read as their primary one.
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Postby Neko- » Wed May 03, 2006 8:23 am

Don't particularly care, tho I do like to see them used sparingly. Filling up a fic with those words starts to work distracting.
Also noted should be a consistant use. If you're going to use them, then be consistent about it, and use them throughout the fic. Don't switch halfway through.
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Postby GenocideHeart » Sat May 20, 2006 12:12 pm

I don't mind Japanese words for stuff like techniques, honorfics and whatnot. But its use should be limited. In small quantities, it's OK. Too much... bleh.
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Postby Bjorn » Sun May 21, 2006 8:08 am

As someone who'd fluent in Japanese, I personally wince whenever I see a Ranma no baka when Ranma, you idiot could have been used. Arguements that such phrases are used to give an authentic flavor to the fic are absurd. The story is written in English. If I wanted to give it this authentic flavor which such authors claim to prize, then would I write my entire story in romanized Japanese?
The only exception I'd go for is when there're phrases or terms which simply cannot be expressed properly in English, like honorifics and such.
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Postby Cyber_Skaarj » Sun May 21, 2006 8:43 am

Bjorn wrote:As someone who'd fluent in Japanese, I personally wince whenever I see a Ranma no baka when Ranma, you idiot could have been used.

I'd wince if it was the other way round myself. "Ranma no Baka!" doesn't translate to just "Ranma, you idiot!", it also can be used for "jerk" and "moron". Baka is one word that doesn't straight translate into English, and that phrase itself is much more accepted by Ranma fandom than any English version, because most fans of Ranma 1/2 have seen the anime in Japanese with subtitles, so they prefer to see it written how they heard it.
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Postby Bjorn » Sun May 21, 2006 9:02 am

Baka is one word that doesn't straight translate into English, and that phrase itself is much more accepted by Ranma fandom than any English version, because most fans of Ranma 1/2 have seen the anime in Japanese with subtitles, so they prefer to see it written how they heard it.

It's a far more acceptable alternative than seeing Japanese arbitrarily inserted into a story written in English.
If English-speaking fans prefer to see it written how they heard it, then I'd be happy to write my fics in romanized Japanese, but I doubt they'd appreciate it. :P
Here's a counter example: Furinkan High School is almost never referred to as Furinkan Koukou.
Last edited by Bjorn on Sun May 21, 2006 10:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Cyber_Skaarj » Sun May 21, 2006 10:40 am

Here's a counter example: Furinkan High School is almost never referred to as Furinkan Kookou.

And here's a counter-counter example: Furinkan Kookou isn't a well known character's catchphrase like Ranma no Baka is.
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Postby Bjorn » Sun May 21, 2006 10:54 am

Well, if you're going by that, then Ryouga's "Kore wa doko da?!" - "Where (on earth) am I?!" should also be a fan favorite. I guess it's a matter of preference, but personally it bugs me when Japanese is used like that.
Like you said, baka has more than one meaning (idiot, jerk, etc.), but it generally has just one meaning per usage. What I mean is that it doesn't have compound or culturally foreign meanings that couldn't be easily covered using English equivalents. If Ranma fails his test, then he'd be an idiot. If Ranma is late for a date with Akane, he's a jerk. Both could be covered by baka, granted. But why do so when you can get your point across perfectly using English?
The same can't be said for, say, the honorifics -chan and -sama.
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Postby lwf58 » Sun May 21, 2006 1:10 pm

What Bjorn said.
As the old saying goes, is it right to jump off a cliff just because everyone else does it?
The only time Japanese should be used in English-language fan fiction is when there is no term in English that can get the point across. Some examples of those are honorifics, technique names, foods, and words that have no English equivalent. Some of those words are ones like:
Engawa (The combination porch-hallway that runs beside the Tendo's family room and overlooks the koi pond.)
Koi (Koi aren't just "goldfish".)
Shoji (Sliding doors, yes, but shoji are constructed of materials not used in the west.)
Okonomiyaki (As I noted in the fanfiction vs. manga thread, okonomiyaki are not pizza or pancakes. There's no food like okonomiyaki in the west.)
On the other hand, there are many Japanese words that are used in fan fiction that shouldn't be because there is a perfectly good English word that can be. There is nothing at all wrong with "Ranma, you jerk!"
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Postby Cyber_Skaarj » Mon May 22, 2006 3:32 pm

lwf58 wrote:On the other hand, there are many Japanese words that are used in fan fiction that shouldn't be because there is a perfectly good English word that can be. There is nothing at all wrong with "Ranma, you jerk!"

Excpet that "Baka!" sounds better, has far more meanings to it, can be used in more ways, and can be said in a far more forceful way than any of the so-called English "equivilents". To be honest I find it a much more versatile insult than anything we have in the English language.
Bjorn wrote:Well, if you're going by that, then Ryouga's "Kore wa doko da?!" - "Where (on earth) am I?!" should also be a fan favorite. I guess it's a matter of preference, but personally it bugs me when Japanese is used like that.

Not really. As much as it might be one of his favourite sayings, it isn't use anywhere near as much as Akane's is. And since she is in practically every episode (give or take one or two), where as he is not, her little catchphrase has far more use, and therefore is something that most people prefer beacuse it's so frequent.
This is more of a personal preference (like you stated), but the word "Baka" is something I much prefer to see over any English version of it. It is however, the only word other than the 'must use' words (honorifics and so on) that I prefer to see in fanfiction over the English "equivilents". Other common words, such as Gomen (sorry) or Ja ne! (See ya!) I'm not really bothered about seeing in either English or Japanese, and full sentences and uncommon words in Japanese I outright dislike.
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Postby Anchoku » Sun May 28, 2006 7:24 pm

If I might point out some recent, wrongful usage.
[“Of course I don’t you Dumbcof! Who would?” Asuka said, looking at the other person in disbelief.]
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Postby Alathon » Sun May 28, 2006 8:13 pm

Cyber_Skaarj wrote:Excpet that "Baka!" sounds better, has far more meanings to it, can be used in more ways, and can be said in a far more forceful way than any of the so-called English "equivilents". To be honest I find it a much more versatile insult than anything we have in the English language.

Reading "baka" in a fanfic written in English tells me that the author is trying to replace competently written dialog with a cutesy fanboism.
The word "baka" having multiple discrete meanings, which have their own words in English, makes this usage in written stories even sillier than other gratuitous usages such as "hai" and "ie". The meaning of the word "baka" would be deterimined by body language, tone, and context, and two of these three are difficult to convey effectively in text. Using the appropriate English words results in a more accurate representation of what the characters are saying.
And finally, "fuck you" is the versatile English insult you're looking for. Based on tone, inflection, body language, and context, it can have a wide range of meanings.
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Postby antimatterenergy » Mon May 29, 2006 1:02 am

"fuck you" is not a good word to replace baka since it has connotations that baka doesn't namely the sexual connotations and is a much stronger and more personal insult. (Fuck you gets you in trouble at school where as Baka while generally derogatory the teacher would ignore.) Also using the word baka would tell you that the person is from Tokyo or eastern Japan since western Japan and Osako would use the word aho.
The Japanese do have words that are equivalent to "fuck you" these words are somewhat equivalent:
Mocca-Mocca Su Su - fuck you
Zakennayo - Fuck You
Though generally it would be better to use words such as idiot, moron, silly, crazy, and dumb-ass in fanfiction unless you can accurately use Baka in context and show which meaning for the word should be used.
Also using Baka as an insult to Ranma is also somewhat of a pun since Ranma's name means wild-horse and the characters for baka mean deer-horse in Chinese.
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