Multiple Languages in Fiction Debate

[Konsaki]

Topic: How to indicate multiple different languages being spoken in written fiction

Specifics: There are at least three different sides to this debate;

1 - that all languages should be written verbatim in their natural lettering or symbols inside the text (e.g. use 'Neko' instead of 'Cat' when a character speaks Japanese)
2 - that the non-standard languages for the piece should be formatted differently but stated so in advance (e.g. in an English speaking area, use [Cat] instead of "Neko" when saying 'Cat' in Japanese)
3 - that all languages should be written in the same language as the piece but with text stating which language was being said at the time (e.g. "Cat," he said in Japanese.)

[Noy Telinú]

I go with 2.

I think.

It's using {Nya} vs "meow" right?

[Spokavriel]

Where possible an entire fic should be presented in one language. Emphasizing languages that one or more characters in a scene can not understand is important but where there is no one that would not understand it isn't that important seeing as the presentation of the characters should make it obvious they didn't instantly start taking up other languages.

[Crescent Pulsar S]

I chose "other." While I personally prefer option three (because I'm willing to work hard should it ever come to that), it'd be silly to expect others to do what I would do simply because we're both literate. That would especially apply to stories where the author knows that the language barrier is going to become a problem for them, when they expect some conversations to get complicated in regard to who is speaking to whom. Like option two, I think option one is also conditional. It'd be better to use the language of your audience, but sometimes your native tongue doesn't translate the other language well or come out sounding right in the given context. And in cases where the audience should have been exposed to the word enough, using "tsunami" instead of "tidal wave" really shouldn't be a problem.

In the end, it's about basing your choices on reason rather than doing whatever just because. If someone were to give me a decent reason for why they did something unconventional, I'd have no problem with it at all. Just don't debase a language because of your own shortcomings and/or preferences.

[uragaaru]

I prefer the third option, unless the language is meant to be incomprehensible to the characters/audience.

Example is a story of mine where Chinese is written in Chinese because only one character knows the language and purposely uses it to hide info that isn't necessary for the audience to know beyond the fact that the character is hiding something.

In a situation where we have an extended conversation or where the contrast between language is the important thing, I will utilize italics, but nothing else. I prefer to contextualize as much as possible.

[Noy Telinú]

"Oh dear…" Nodoka's face flashed with concern. "How severe?"

"Restricted to dating at the moment." Ranko stood up. "I'm going to change…"

Nodoka nodded and switched languages. ^Gender or clothes?^

^Clothes… I didn't tell her yet.^ Ranko walked away.

Nodoka sighed. "Sorry about that… but my daughter is being secretive at the moment…"

Akane nodded, but she was surprised at what just happened. "How did you two learn Chinese?"

"Mandarin," Nodoka corrected. "My daughter learned it while traveling inChina. She taught me for a number of reasons… Now, enough about Ranko. I want to get to know you."

This is sort of how I handle it. Using it strategically. Also, so that Shampoo can get across that she has a brain.

[PCHeintz72]

It is also needed or at least used in phone conversations to indicate from the perspective of someone talking whom is not present... or a mental vice in the head for the same reasons...

I'm for menthods of formatting that work in both rich text or HTML or BBCode formats, yet still show up in a copy paste to TXT or Raw formats... so items like underline, bold, script, super/subscript, or others that would not copy well I am against.

Ditto scene breaks... a HTML scene break does not come over when copy pasting into a TXT editor...

Formatting should remain as clean as possible. Paragraph should change at each speaker, and have a blank line between them... simple indenting may not carry over between platforms/formats.

These restrictions are not just good form for those readers like me whom prefer straight text which some believe backward... but these days you cannot assume the platform this is being viewed on is a straight PC, but could be a phone, tablet, kindel, nook, or some other oddball device. Also, it may work well *now*, but you have to think how will it look going forward on future formats...

[Ellen Kuhfeld]

I've had the most luck using mode 3 -- though I modify it with small dashes of mode 1. In manga or anime fanfiction, "neko" counts as English for most purposes.

[khammel]

'Other' was my choice. I have both called out languages in the text and used typography to single them out. I also occasionally embed Japanese honorifics for 'flavor'. So that could be 1, 2, and 3.

Normally, foreign languages are flagged when used. Here is an example of what I did to have the same character speak Mandarin and Japanese in the same paragraph...

Ranma prepared a practiced but radiant smile as she spoke mandarin like a native, "Hello, I'm Ranma. How may I serve, " as she turned. First Nodoka's surprised then Genma's startled face arrested her attention. "You" she spat in rusty Japanese. She froze in concentration, mapping thoughts to the words of her mother tongue. Genma took advantage of the pause to turn and run. Switching to her father's language, she took off after him, "You're gonna pay, Pops. With interest!" Ranma shouted in accented, rusty Japanese as she pursued her quarry.

Then there is the issue of mental communication. I tried embedding "Psi-Techs" comunication in the prose without specific demarcation. This does to work well in a complicated paragraph. Discussion with pre-readers on fukufics.com resulted in me using italics. I am uncertain how to do this in pure ASCII (which I had used exclusively until this came up a month ago in C&C).

“He says he loves you too, Akane-san. And he loves hearing your voice right now.” I sort of have to be in the middle here. Where I’m happy to be, Ranma-san. Tuxedo Kamen responded to his brother’s soul after passing Ranma’s love to his wife.

[Cheb]

2, "formatted differently" ofthen doesn't work, or gets damaged by FFnet, it loads the reader with remembering extra format marks (not that hard to memorize, but why should they bother?) It looks unprofessional too.

I use 1 or 3 depending if the current-POV-character can understand it.

Worked fine until I introduced an OC whose speech is full of English techno-babble that goes over Ranma's head. Easily done in a Russian fic about Japanese characters, just transliterate it phonetically... oopsie. How should I convey this in the English version? The current idea is to use heavy Engrish in italics. Not sure if it would work. We'll see when I get to posting it.

P.S There's one trick to expand on 3. X says something, Y asks him to clarify, repeating some of X's words in a clearly mangled manner, thus showing that there was a language barrier between them.
"Set me free, Ivan-tsarevich, I'll be of use to you"
"I'm sorry, is 'Iwanutsarewichu' your name?"